Balance: The news of the day is that the administration has been spying on citizens. Not just based on some reasonable suspension but in general. National security is something that is such a duck soap and often does not just mean spying on someone that has a Islamic sir name.
But to give any authority unlimited power is to risk them becoming a unlimited authority. The temptation of that kind of power is to misuse it and inspires the power to become a authoritarian interloper. And such powers are a double edge sword.
Since it is not limited to own the current administration but could in turn be used by the next or the one following. Imagine if the Neo-Cons were to suddenly have the same powers? This blog and those whom contribute to it would then be on the enemy’s list and have their entire life under scrutiny.
Every word would be counted and logged for some future action at the discretions of some low level Nazi-like authoritarian.
Fear is something that causes unreasoning thoughts and actions.
Fearful actions can become something that is acceptable and normal.
A democracies greatest enemy is itself, it is so open to every flow ad eddy that it can mold itself to the unreasoning..
LOL on this subject: I just had someone who said he was with the cable company who was going to be checking the cable out back? So if you do not hear from me in the next few days…. ? It has happened before, “their coming to take me away ha-ha their coming to take me away Ho-ho!
I hated The Patriot Act when it was passed under Bush2, I hate it today when it seems to have been expanded under Obama. I remember well the republicans laughing and poking fun at me being upset about someone seeing my library records. I remember being downright angry that the F.I.S.A. court was bypassed by Bush2 — at least President Obama seems to not be doing that. I remember reminding republicans that the power taken by one president will be available to the next…
I don’t suppose we’ll ever understand. If indeed there are good reasons for collecting phone call logs we’re not going to be told those reasons. And I understand why and agree there are many things we shouldn’t be privy to. If it is something that should be public knowledge there wouldn’t even be a need of the F.I.S.A. court order. I’m sure Issa will have moreandmore investigations and while doing them maybe he will make even more information public that should be kept secret. He’s accomplished that before and I’m sure he’s capable of doing it again! He hates Obama way more than he loves America!
Republicans who felt safe under Bush now profess to be in danger under Obama. [eye roll] If it’s wrong, if powers are being abused, if it’s something that should stop — it’s wrong under every president.
As I understand this – so far – is that a blanket order for phone records was asked of Verizon.
Phone records are not actual phone conversations.
While I may not like the fact my phone record is now considered something of value – if I don’t want any of my actions to be tracked – then I will also need to stop blogging, banking, using that Dillons Plus card for cheaper gas because corporations are tracking our purchases and our penchant for certain brands and/or items – don’t they?
But – at the bottom of all this – is the fact that Congress is at fault here also – and I don’t hear these RePUKES bellyaching about their own colleagues being the spies – do you?
I agree 100% with fnord when she said the next president will use the same power once given…
And don’t forget Facebook and such, Indy. Social media is also evaluated for patterns as are the other, and more, data sources you mentioned.
We had this conversation with Iggy a long time ago. He was not overly disturbed by it because they were looking at patterns, not individual conversations, although they certainly had that authority and technology if they wished to do it. I was surprised since Iggy was usually a champion of privacy and limited government. He, like 617 below, sort of saw it as unstoppable and he could live with it as long as it was broad based.
I think the only thing I have, other than a Verizon phone, an ISP, and Yahoo emails is a Dillons discount card. I don’t use any credit cards or charge accounts of any kind, but I do have a bank account so I guess that’s probably being monitored as well.
I need a bank account, and I use phones, internet and email to do my work and apparently I can’t stop the gathering of that data. If anyone has a desperate need to follow my grocery purchases, they should feel free. I’ll be awaiting a knock from the food police given my unhealthy tastes in food.
The problem with laws like the Patriot Act – the party that first pushed it through all love it when they are in power…
but when the other party is in power – that’s when the party that did it first wants to screech and scream…
But…..in today’s world of foreign AND domestic threats of terrorism – maybe 6176 is correct?
The Patriot Act should not be repealed….but amended when needed.
And then we’re back to the same problem – the party in control at the time will want more power then the other party, when they get into power, will want even more power?
Here is a odd thing, I love to both Skin dive and Scuba dive but I can hardly swim without fins! I can manage to breath stroke and back stroke. But I am so slow and it seems I can barely move.,
Quick update: after causing a bit of eyebrow raising for the nurse today at my presurgery physical (don’t know if it was due to my temperature of 96.4 F, which is totally normal for me, blood pressure inconsistent with the above reading (144/77, later 122/68), or both), all went well. Final check on surgery (right) eye 6/14, and cursory check of left eye then, we are ready for lift-off.
A quick family story: my body temp being “subnormal” was not known for several years. As a direct result thereof, I went to school one morning not feeling well at all (temp was 98.4), and within two hours, erupted into a case of the measles, thereby exposing every other second grader in the room. You just never know. . .
You’re success is an inspiration! I just know the second eye will go even smoother and we’ll hear even more raves about how well you can see!
My body temperature is also lower than the average and by the time i get to 100, which is routinely accepted as an elevated temp, that’s an equivalent to around 102 -3ish. I also almost always feel warmer than other people in the same room. There is no ladylike perspiration when I get really hot I go straight to leak. 🙂
PrairiePopulistsAndProgressives.net 
Balance: The news of the day is that the administration has been spying on citizens. Not just based on some reasonable suspension but in general. National security is something that is such a duck soap and often does not just mean spying on someone that has a Islamic sir name.
But to give any authority unlimited power is to risk them becoming a unlimited authority. The temptation of that kind of power is to misuse it and inspires the power to become a authoritarian interloper. And such powers are a double edge sword.
Since it is not limited to own the current administration but could in turn be used by the next or the one following. Imagine if the Neo-Cons were to suddenly have the same powers? This blog and those whom contribute to it would then be on the enemy’s list and have their entire life under scrutiny.
Every word would be counted and logged for some future action at the discretions of some low level Nazi-like authoritarian.
Fear is something that causes unreasoning thoughts and actions.
Fearful actions can become something that is acceptable and normal.
A democracies greatest enemy is itself, it is so open to every flow ad eddy that it can mold itself to the unreasoning..
LOL on this subject: I just had someone who said he was with the cable company who was going to be checking the cable out back? So if you do not hear from me in the next few days…. ? It has happened before, “their coming to take me away ha-ha their coming to take me away Ho-ho!
We’ll be on the lookout, rd! 😉
I hated The Patriot Act when it was passed under Bush2, I hate it today when it seems to have been expanded under Obama. I remember well the republicans laughing and poking fun at me being upset about someone seeing my library records. I remember being downright angry that the F.I.S.A. court was bypassed by Bush2 — at least President Obama seems to not be doing that. I remember reminding republicans that the power taken by one president will be available to the next…
I don’t suppose we’ll ever understand. If indeed there are good reasons for collecting phone call logs we’re not going to be told those reasons. And I understand why and agree there are many things we shouldn’t be privy to. If it is something that should be public knowledge there wouldn’t even be a need of the F.I.S.A. court order. I’m sure Issa will have moreandmore investigations and while doing them maybe he will make even more information public that should be kept secret. He’s accomplished that before and I’m sure he’s capable of doing it again! He hates Obama way more than he loves America!
Republicans who felt safe under Bush now profess to be in danger under Obama. [eye roll] If it’s wrong, if powers are being abused, if it’s something that should stop — it’s wrong under every president.
As I understand this – so far – is that a blanket order for phone records was asked of Verizon.
Phone records are not actual phone conversations.
While I may not like the fact my phone record is now considered something of value – if I don’t want any of my actions to be tracked – then I will also need to stop blogging, banking, using that Dillons Plus card for cheaper gas because corporations are tracking our purchases and our penchant for certain brands and/or items – don’t they?
But – at the bottom of all this – is the fact that Congress is at fault here also – and I don’t hear these RePUKES bellyaching about their own colleagues being the spies – do you?
I agree 100% with fnord when she said the next president will use the same power once given…
Maybe it’s time to repeal the Patriot Act?
And don’t forget Facebook and such, Indy. Social media is also evaluated for patterns as are the other, and more, data sources you mentioned.
We had this conversation with Iggy a long time ago. He was not overly disturbed by it because they were looking at patterns, not individual conversations, although they certainly had that authority and technology if they wished to do it. I was surprised since Iggy was usually a champion of privacy and limited government. He, like 617 below, sort of saw it as unstoppable and he could live with it as long as it was broad based.
I think the only thing I have, other than a Verizon phone, an ISP, and Yahoo emails is a Dillons discount card. I don’t use any credit cards or charge accounts of any kind, but I do have a bank account so I guess that’s probably being monitored as well.
I need a bank account, and I use phones, internet and email to do my work and apparently I can’t stop the gathering of that data. If anyone has a desperate need to follow my grocery purchases, they should feel free. I’ll be awaiting a knock from the food police given my unhealthy tastes in food.
ROFLMAO – Prairie Pond – I sense we have something else in common…
No matter how hard I try to do better with my diet – sometimes I just crave a big ol’ juicy bacon cheeseburger, fries and a chocolate milkshake.
My doctor put me on a cholesterol medication……and it does help…..LOL
well so far all is still good, I have the internet and no black helicopters over head. There was a B-1 bomber went over head but they did not dwell.
This seems appropriate to the current discussion:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2013/06/06/the-people-have-taken-over-american-politics-and-they-hate-it/
While I agree with indy’s sentiment, the Patriot Act will never be repealed, imho; given that as reality, amendments are needed, and should be made.
The problem with laws like the Patriot Act – the party that first pushed it through all love it when they are in power…
but when the other party is in power – that’s when the party that did it first wants to screech and scream…
But…..in today’s world of foreign AND domestic threats of terrorism – maybe 6176 is correct?
The Patriot Act should not be repealed….but amended when needed.
And then we’re back to the same problem – the party in control at the time will want more power then the other party, when they get into power, will want even more power?
A vicious cycle…..huh?
yes.
Esther Williams passed away this morning. I remember watching her movies when I was growing up.
I never did learn how to swim . Oh, I can dog paddle to save my life. But to actually swim – No sir, that is not one of my talents.
Esther Williams made it look so easy…..didn’t she?
http://movies.msn.com/movies/article.aspx?news=811548
Here is a odd thing, I love to both Skin dive and Scuba dive but I can hardly swim without fins! I can manage to breath stroke and back stroke. But I am so slow and it seems I can barely move.,
Quick update: after causing a bit of eyebrow raising for the nurse today at my presurgery physical (don’t know if it was due to my temperature of 96.4 F, which is totally normal for me, blood pressure inconsistent with the above reading (144/77, later 122/68), or both), all went well. Final check on surgery (right) eye 6/14, and cursory check of left eye then, we are ready for lift-off.
A quick family story: my body temp being “subnormal” was not known for several years. As a direct result thereof, I went to school one morning not feeling well at all (temp was 98.4), and within two hours, erupted into a case of the measles, thereby exposing every other second grader in the room. You just never know. . .
You’re success is an inspiration! I just know the second eye will go even smoother and we’ll hear even more raves about how well you can see!
My body temperature is also lower than the average and by the time i get to 100, which is routinely accepted as an elevated temp, that’s an equivalent to around 102 -3ish. I also almost always feel warmer than other people in the same room. There is no ladylike perspiration when I get really hot I go straight to leak. 🙂
Your second paragraph, fnord, with the exception of “ladylike” might well have been written by me. Ask my daughters; they’ll give affidavits. 🙂