Tuesday, 2/23/10, Public Square


Filed under The Public Square

34 responses to “Tuesday, 2/23/10, Public Square

  1. indypendent

    Who predicts the health care summit will be successful? I’m interested to see if any of those Republican proposals are in the proposed health care bill and I am most anxious to hear how the Party of No will spin the fact that maybe, just maybe, some of their ideas were in the health care bill from the start?

    But that might be too near the truth and I dare say, we won’t be hearing any such language like that from some of those partisan GOP hacks.

  2. fnord

    From what I’ve read all the Republican proposals are included in the suggested reform bill posted yesterday as well as both bills currently stalled in reconciliation.

    That was their first excuse — no one listens to our ideas. Since that excuse has been exposed they have moved on to the next excuse which is intrusive government meddling. The free market will see to it that insurance companies meet demand, they say.

  3. fnord

    No, I don’t see the health care summit being successful — at least not in accomplishing compromise. It could be the final straw, the final attempt to involve the Party of No. I don’t even have high hopes for that. I’m disgusted with President Obama and the democratic majority who think they can actually get compromise. It won’t happen, so move along and cram it down their throats.

  4. fnord

    Even sadder, the only people who will actually watch or even know the truth of what went on are those of us who already know, already pay attention. We are a small minority. Most Americans, even most voters, don’t pay attention. This is their choice, they simply aren’t interested enough to make it a priority. They’re busy and like everyone they pick and choose what they make time for. News soundbites is what many rely on.

  5. fnord

    There is a group on Facebook who call themselves the Coffee Party Movement. This is (I think) a synopsis of what they’re about:

    We recognize that the federal gov’t is not the enemy of the people, but the expression of our collective will…As voters & volunteers, we will support leaders who work toward positive solutions, & hold accountable those who obstruct them.

    They’ve also posted this message to Congress:

    Our message to Congress: You work for us not corporations. We hired you and we get to fire you. We pay you and give you great health insurance. Now get to work serving us or get out. Anyone who wants our government to get to work in the interest of ordinary Americans, not corporations, is welcome to join this movement.

    I believe that many in the Tea Party are regular folks like us who are misled into thinking that the federal government is the cause of their struggles, anxiety and fear, in short, their enemy. The fact is, we have a democracy with a loophole. The most active and organized constituents dominate the process. And for many years, corporations have dominated the process because they can afford to pay thousands of lobbyists to actively influence the government. They have money. But we have the votes.

    We have to flex our muscles as voters and be actively engaged even though we are busy, overworked and underpaid. We have to take back our government or as Elizabeth Warren said, “the game is over.” We are doomed economically, medically, culturally if we don’t act now.

    We’ve got to get the message out asap. We’re not about taking shots at the tea party. We are about solutions, cooperation, dealing with the reality that we’re in trouble as a nation. We’re about getting to work. Let’s discard the labels that obfuscate reality like Democrat, Republican, conservative and liberal. Those words just create and perpetuate the illusion that politics is like a football game. One team wins, the other loses. That’s just not accurate and it is a distraction, like shadow puppets on a wall.

    Democracy is not a zero sum game. The reality is, as a nation, we will all lose if we stay on the path that we are on of not owning up to all the warning signs that we are economically and culturally at peril. We are near bankruptcy as a nation. We have squandered our credit as the defender of freedom and the leader of the world. We can’t go on just fighting and not working together, folks. If you must, just think of America as our team instead of our parties or some other political affiliation.

    Let’s stand up now. We make a pact right now that we stand together no matter. The ones with the most to lose will bully us with smear campaigns and intimidation tactics. We don’t back down. We stand together now and we will win. We must win. Take a look at the children around you and you know that we have to stand up right now.

    Please take a moment to look at this: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/01/27/elizabeth-warren-the-chip_n_438379.html

    • fnord

      I don’t know how long ago the Coffee Party Movement started, but they currently have just over 8,000 fans on Facebook.



      That is what I have been doing a really bad job of trying to say. We all have to come together under the banner of saving the country and the system that our founders began. We can continue on the way we are, but we will soon end up without the peace, liberty and justice that the founders tried SO HARD to write into the Constitution.

      So, I am in with the Coffee Party, if it is something more than a parlour game to annoy the tea party. I am looking to bridge the gaps and bring people together, not continue the divisive politics that got us to where we are. That is a tool of the corporate masters and we have to stop playing into their hands.

      The founding fathers and freedom fighters that established this free nation did not all think alike. Yet they coalesced around the foundation of ideas that all men are created equal and they share certain unalienable rights that are endowed, not by any government but, by their creator; so that no government EVER has the lawful or moral authority to take these rights away. They coalesced under the ideas that people should be able to make their own destiny and that what they earned should be theirs and no government or judicial authority should be able to take it from them without just cause. They disagreed on MANY other things. But they agreed on these principles and agreed to fight side-by-side to attain them for themselves and future generations.

      Why can’t we do the same?

  6. indypendent

    Thanks for the heads up about this new Coffee Party movement.

    Maybe this is the beginning of some common sense returning to politics (I’m not holding my breath, but I am holding out hope).

    The Tea Party is just another arm of the Republican Party – just like the Fox News. And, for that reason, I don’t listen to either one of them!

  7. fnord

    I’ve been looking at their website and so far I’m impressed with the information.

    I especially like that they recognize government must be part of solutions, and isn’t the enemy but our vehicle for progress.

    • indypendent

      I always have to chuckle at these Tea Partiers and other Republicans stating how much they hate government spending but have no problem with keeping their Medicare intact and giving taxpayer money to certain corporations.

      So the government is only evil when Obama wants to give every American an opportunity through the spending of taxpayer money but that same government is good when it gives taxpayers money to Republicans?

      It certainly sounds like an attitude of ‘I’ve got mine and I don’t care about you’.

      And this is the side these Evangelical Christians are on? God forgive them because they are obviously blinded by their own greed and arrogance.

  8. fnord

    They seem calm (maybe it’s decaffeinated?), not angry but motivated to find solutions and make improvements.

  9. tosmarttobegop

    Ahh I guess I can not serve two masters, Been draining into a good horror story I am writing.
    So the following day it takes almost all day to think about the blogs other then something I have already thought about.

    LOL Also Politics tends to be not much thought about something that should have much thought into it!

  10. lilacluvr

    Lately politics has become something people don’t give much thought to other than the next 30 second soundbite or the next hot babe winking and saying those folksy downhome sayings that mean absolutely nothing.

    But I looked at that Coffee Party website and I signed up for their newsletters. Hopefully this group can find some solid support and give those tea baggers a run for their corporate-bought money.

    I wonder what the statistics are of coffee drinkers vs tea drinkers?

    Especially when that tea has been spiked with the pond scum of the GOP.

    • fnord

      I think the coffee drinkers are a recent beginning and have a ways to go on getting their word out before they would catch up to the tea drinkers. Plus, since the tea party has lots of big bucks behind them, they will probably remain much better known.

      • lilacluvr

        And the Tea Partiers are known for their costumes they wear, the hateful signs they display and the tantrums they throw.

        This will keep alot of independents and moderates from joining their little tea party that is supported by the corrupt Republican corporatization of America.

        And perhaps some of those original tea parties that are for throwing all the incumbents out of office and cleaning up the corruption in politics will learn of the Coffee Party and join forces.

        Politics has been known to have some strange bedfellows band together to get stuff done.

  11. fnord

    Ya know, I’ve spoken with many people who are interested in some of what the tea party movement espouses. But, and that is always a BIG but, they deplore the shenanigans, the costumes, the violence, the anger, and the anti-government sentiments expressed.

    As we’ve often discussed, there’s probably more WE THE PEOPLE agree on than we disagree on. But the anger and need for someone to be wrong and lose (so someone can win?) highlights the differences rather than builds on the agreements.

    • lilacluvr

      That need to be right and someone to be wrong comes from the Religious Right freaks – I’m afraid.

      It’s that superiority complex they seem to all have.

      After all, they are God’s favorites – you know that, don’t you?


      • fnord

        I have seen too many who profess to be Christian perfecting the ability to hate. I don’t think those people sound like they’re following the teachings of Christianity, but it isn’t my right to judge. Besides, they seem to have that ‘judging’ stuff down to a fine art.

  12. fnord

    From the ‘message to Congress’ posted above:

    “Democracy is not a zero sum game. The reality is, as a nation, we will all lose if we stay on the path that we are on of not owning up to all the warning signs that we are economically and culturally at peril.”

    I like very much that the Coffee Party Movement recognizes that we all lose unless we cooperate and work together. I like that their message is positive. I like that they are FOR something.

    • lilacluvr

      I like the fact that they are saying ‘we will all lose if we stay on the path that we are on’

      I view global warming in the same light. I really do not care to debate if the cause is man-made or natural because I personally believe it is both.

      But these Republican naysayers are so bent on being ‘right’ that global warming is not man-made that we have not gotten off the road of destruction we are on as a nation. And they use this as another wedge issue.

      And all the while, our planet is definitely changing and we are sitting around still debating?

      I cannot tolerate arrogance and stupidity.

  13. lilacluvr

    These self-professing ‘real’ Christians are also the ones who have somehow justified supporting all those golden-ladeled churches with multi-million dollar budgets.

    When was Jesus ever laden down in gold?

    These people are just those that have twisted the Scriptures into somehow justifying their own behavior – in whatever they choose to do or say.

    • lilacluvr

      I am not judging – I am calling it the way I see it.

      After all, if they claim to be ‘real’ Christians and ‘real’ Americans, then I can use the intelligence God gave me to ascertain if what they claim is really true.

      I simply compare Jesus’ teachings and the way he lived his life to those self-professing ‘real’ Christians.

      If the people are not doing what Jesus did and taught, then I can only assume that they are not ‘real’ Christians following the teachings of their Lord and Savior – Jesus Christ.

      It’s no different than them judging the rest of us to not be ‘real’ Christians or ‘real’ Americans.

      What’s good for the goose is good for the gander.

  14. fnord

    I saw a bumper sticker that read —

    You Might Be A Wing Nut If Christianity Has Become
    Perfecting The Art Of Hate Without Guilt.

    • fnord

      I’m pretty sure being hateful would make for a potload of guilt. 🙂 At least for those who are filled with the Spirit of God.

  15. lilacluvr

    That’s a good one. What really irritates me is that these hypocrit Christians give Christianity a bad name. There are alot of good people who call themselves Christians and do not deserve to be lumped into the same group as the Wing Nuts.

    Funny, isn’t it, these Wing Nuts rant and rave about the good Muslims not coming out and denouncing the bad Muslims but when good Christians come out and denounce the Wing Nuts, somehow these Wing Nuts play the victim card of being persecuted.

    I tell you, these Wing Nuts have all the bases covered – don’t they?

    They have their Superior God, they have the promise of forgiveness when they sin, and they have the gift of judging all those around them as being heathens if we all do not fall into agreement and worship at their superior feet and agree with them on everything.

    Let’s not forget the most important thing – they want all the money too. Those golden monuments they build to themselves don’t come cheap, you know.

  16. lilacluvr

    Speaking of Wing Nuts, remember Ted Haggard? He and his lovely wife was on the Joy Behar show. They were talking about how Tiger Woods can save his marriage. As if Tiger needs their advice.

    Haggard actually had the guts to say that he lost everything when the truth came out about him. Huh? Didn’t his church pay him quite a handsome settlement to get out of town?

    Wouldn’t I like to be paid that handsomely for doing wrong and lying about it.

    And then his lovely wife wrote a book soon to be released – and no doubt they are thinking and praying about making a comeback in the ministry serving God – and collecting all that money for book sales and speaking fees.

    These people are unbelievable. But look no further than Fox talking head idiots to see the same type of phoney-baloney people raking in the big bucks. Just take a look at these peoples’ personal lives and then just ask yourself – why are they now making millions off simple-minded people?

  17. tosmarttobegop

    HEEEE Oh my wife put child-proof locks on the Kitchen cabinet and I can not open the damn thing!!!

    Oh I so suck!!!!!

    I guess I need to call my daughter to bring the five years old over to open it!

    • lilacluvr

      LOL – While the 5 yr old opens the kitchen cabinets, maybe they can look at all the parental controls on the television, set any controls on the computer that is needed, etc.

      You get my drift – the kids are the ones that can do all that stuff faster than adults.

      And those child-proof caps from the pharmacy – they are also not that child-proof, believe me.

    • fnord

      I have to (annually) sign a form to get regular caps on medications — can’t open those child-proof ones unless a child is around to do it for me. 🙂

  18. lilacluvr

    CNN’s website reports that Dick Cheney had a mild heart attack but is okay. He underwent a heart catheterization and will probably be discharged in the next day or two.

    He was having lunch with his family and helping to edit a chapter in the book he is writing.

    In the words of the famous Church Lady – Isn’t that special.

    I’m so glad he was able to take advantage of the wonderful health care system that taxpayer money can buy.

    • fnord

      His health seemed to fare better when he stayed in his non-disclosed location. Since he’s been out doing interviews and telling everyone what a good job bushco did, and what a poor job President Obama is doing he’s put some extra stress and strain on his heart.

  19. fnord

    I’m not sure anyone here wants to read this word for word, but it’s easily scanned and you won’t miss anything at all if you don’t read it carefully. I don’t ever listen to rush, and wonder if this is really the way he speaks. Is he capable of full sentences?

    Glenn Beck Gets Rushed

    • lilacluvr

      I have listened to Rush a few times (not the entire 3 hours at a sitting because I do have a brain that is working and cannot stand to allow my mind to turn to mush).

      Rush talks in short sentences. In fact, he rambles from one topic to the next in short, inconcise sentences. It is like listening to a habitual liar. You know the type of person that rambles on and on, changing the subject, in the hope that nobody catches on that they are full of it.

  20. G-stir

    Dick Cheney has a heart attack? I didn’t know he ever had a heart installation to allow such an atttack! Talk about spin!